Warning over cats killed by antifreeze

Echo: Warning over cats killed by antifreeze Warning over cats killed by antifreeze

PET owners have been warned to be extra-vigilant after a spate of reports of cats being poisoned by antifreeze.

Staff at Basildon-based Cherrydown Vets, say they are unsure if someone is deliberately poisoning the pets, or if it is happening by accident.

Practice owner Jonathan Nurse said five poisoned cats had been brought in in just six weeks and it had only been possible to save one of them.

He said: “It’s not unusual to have antifreeze poisoning cases in cats, but we’ve never before seen a cluster of them together in the summer.

“We don’t know whether it is significant or just an accident.

They have all been from Basildon, but not from one particular area.”

Vets across the borough usually see more poisoned cats in the winter because more drivers use antifreeze at that time of year and have it sitting around.

However, it is unusual for them to see any cases during the summer.

Mr Nurse said the surgery did consider reporting the incidents to the police, but decided not to, as it had no proof the posioning was deliberate.

He added: “The toxic compound in the antifreeze is also in screenwash for cars. It could be someone has spilled some and not cleaned it up.

“Cats really do only need to drink a very small amount to be affected and they do seem attracted to it. By the time the symptoms show, it’s often too late to do anything about it, unfortunately.”

The surgery is appealing to drivers to make sure they clear up any spillages of antifreeze and screen wash, no matter how small.

Mr Nurse said he would be keeping an eye out for any more cases to see if a pattern was emerging.

He added: “If you do clean it up then it will make a difference.”

Comments (36)

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9:09am Mon 7 Jul 14

scrounger‎ says...

We need manufacturers to put a repellent in the anti freeze.
We need manufacturers to put a repellent in the anti freeze. scrounger‎
  • Score: 24

9:11am Mon 7 Jul 14

supermadmax says...

Most serial killers start with animals.
Most serial killers start with animals. supermadmax
  • Score: 18

9:40am Mon 7 Jul 14

Jack222 says...

Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner

If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun.
Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun. Jack222
  • Score: -23

10:05am Mon 7 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

supermadmax wrote:
Most serial killers start with animals.
Broken record........
[quote][p][bold]supermadmax[/bold] wrote: Most serial killers start with animals.[/p][/quote]Broken record........ Russ13
  • Score: -7

10:07am Mon 7 Jul 14

pembury53 says...

Jack222 wrote:
Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner

If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun.
sounds as if you could be the 'antifreeze stalker'....... incidentally, the concept of an animal kiling for 'fun' is nonsense, it's human beings that have made that particular trait all their own....
[quote][p][bold]Jack222[/bold] wrote: Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun.[/p][/quote]sounds as if you could be the 'antifreeze stalker'....... incidentally, the concept of an animal kiling for 'fun' is nonsense, it's human beings that have made that particular trait all their own.... pembury53
  • Score: 19

10:11am Mon 7 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

Jack222 wrote:
Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner

If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun.
Amen!!!

Whilst I wouldn't wish deliberate harm on animals (just making sure I'm not going to get labelled a "serial killer") the fact is that animals that are allowed to roam freely by their owners can easily get themselves into trouble.

I hate cats, I don't see the point of them but each to their own. What I object to the most is having to clear their crap from my garden on a constant basis and then have do-gooders tell me what I can/can't leave laying around on my own property just in case a wandering animal is stupid enough to eat/drink something that might be harmful to it.

If someone is deliberately leaving harmful substances about then that's out of order and they need to be dealt with but other than that isn't this just "Dawin" in action?
[quote][p][bold]Jack222[/bold] wrote: Shall we just start with the more likely; antifreeze left in a garage or windscreen cleaner If worried keep your cat at home! That way they wont defecate in all our backyards nor kill birds and other small animals for fun.[/p][/quote]Amen!!! Whilst I wouldn't wish deliberate harm on animals (just making sure I'm not going to get labelled a "serial killer") the fact is that animals that are allowed to roam freely by their owners can easily get themselves into trouble. I hate cats, I don't see the point of them but each to their own. What I object to the most is having to clear their crap from my garden on a constant basis and then have do-gooders tell me what I can/can't leave laying around on my own property just in case a wandering animal is stupid enough to eat/drink something that might be harmful to it. If someone is deliberately leaving harmful substances about then that's out of order and they need to be dealt with but other than that isn't this just "Dawin" in action? Russ13
  • Score: -24

10:16am Mon 7 Jul 14

I-say-you-say says...

Of course it's on purpose!

The owners let their cats out to wander around unsupervised ON PURPOSE, trespassing onto the property of people who do not want them there (the amount of cat's footprints/scratches etc I have found on my car bonnet).

I would never purposefully hurt an animal however if you don't want your "precious pet" to get poisoned, run over, lost etc etc there is a simple way to prevent it - DON'T LET IT OUT!

As Russ13 said - why should we clean up after and ensure our property is safe for an animal that is not ours?!
Of course it's on purpose! The owners let their cats out to wander around unsupervised ON PURPOSE, trespassing onto the property of people who do not want them there (the amount of cat's footprints/scratches etc I have found on my car bonnet). I would never purposefully hurt an animal however if you don't want your "precious pet" to get poisoned, run over, lost etc etc there is a simple way to prevent it - DON'T LET IT OUT! As Russ13 said - why should we clean up after and ensure our property is safe for an animal that is not ours?! I-say-you-say
  • Score: -28

10:46am Mon 7 Jul 14

Chris Flunk says...

supermadmax wrote:
Most serial killers start with animals.
Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals".
[quote][p][bold]supermadmax[/bold] wrote: Most serial killers start with animals.[/p][/quote]Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals". Chris Flunk
  • Score: -2

10:54am Mon 7 Jul 14

CarnMountification says...

Chris Flunk wrote:
supermadmax wrote:
Most serial killers start with animals.
Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals".
Dates you as well flunky, for knowing the fact.
[quote][p][bold]Chris Flunk[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]supermadmax[/bold] wrote: Most serial killers start with animals.[/p][/quote]Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals".[/p][/quote]Dates you as well flunky, for knowing the fact. CarnMountification
  • Score: 5

1:14pm Mon 7 Jul 14

emcee says...

I dislike cats a lot. They do, indeed, kill the bird life and they do, indeed, cr*p (not all cats bury it) in gardens that are not their own. However, I would not deliberately kill a cat.

Cat owners run the risk of their cats being injured or killed every day when they leave them to roam the neighbourhood. They can be injured by dogs or other animals, they can get run over by cars and they can be accidentally poisoned, either by man made chemicals or by natural means (some types of lilly pollen for example).
I doubt these cats are all being deliberately poisoned but I am afraid, putting cats in danger by exposing them to the dangers of the outside world is part and parcel of allowing them to roam.

Cats area lazy by nature. All wild cats, big and small, only hunt and exert themselves out of necessity. If pet cats are provided with somwhere warm to sleep, food to fill their belly and a nice litter tray to do their business, cats would be quite content to stay at home. In fact, more and more owners are coming round to the idea of "house cats". However, a lot of owners still, wrongly, believe that cats should be aloud to, or need to, roam, or maybe it is just convenient for their cat to be kicked out during parts of the day or night.

Whatever the facts, all cat owners should be aware that "outside" is an increasingly dangerous world for cats and the best way to ensure they are as safe as possible is to keep them at home.
I dislike cats a lot. They do, indeed, kill the bird life and they do, indeed, cr*p (not all cats bury it) in gardens that are not their own. However, I would not deliberately kill a cat. Cat owners run the risk of their cats being injured or killed every day when they leave them to roam the neighbourhood. They can be injured by dogs or other animals, they can get run over by cars and they can be accidentally poisoned, either by man made chemicals or by natural means (some types of lilly pollen for example). I doubt these cats are all being deliberately poisoned but I am afraid, putting cats in danger by exposing them to the dangers of the outside world is part and parcel of allowing them to roam. Cats area lazy by nature. All wild cats, big and small, only hunt and exert themselves out of necessity. If pet cats are provided with somwhere warm to sleep, food to fill their belly and a nice litter tray to do their business, cats would be quite content to stay at home. In fact, more and more owners are coming round to the idea of "house cats". However, a lot of owners still, wrongly, believe that cats should be aloud to, or need to, roam, or maybe it is just convenient for their cat to be kicked out during parts of the day or night. Whatever the facts, all cat owners should be aware that "outside" is an increasingly dangerous world for cats and the best way to ensure they are as safe as possible is to keep them at home. emcee
  • Score: -13

3:34pm Mon 7 Jul 14

I-say-you-say says...

Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative.

How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere?

How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?!

I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up!
Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up! I-say-you-say
  • Score: -11

3:39pm Mon 7 Jul 14

supermadmax says...

Chris Flunk wrote:
supermadmax wrote:
Most serial killers start with animals.
Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals".
I'm afraid not, I read it in the ice man about Richard Kuklinski.

But, thanks interesting info, thanks.
[quote][p][bold]Chris Flunk[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]supermadmax[/bold] wrote: Most serial killers start with animals.[/p][/quote]Ah, a proponent of the Macdonald triad eh? That somewhat dates you old chap. While it was popularly accepted in the mid 1960s it's now seen as being largely an urban myth. Even John Macdonald has since said "he could find no statistically significant association between homicide perpetrators and early problems with . . . cruelty to animals".[/p][/quote]I'm afraid not, I read it in the ice man about Richard Kuklinski. But, thanks interesting info, thanks. supermadmax
  • Score: 7

3:48pm Mon 7 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

I-say-you-say wrote:
Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative.

How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere?

How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?!

I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up!
It's very easy for someone to click a button rather than substantiate their opinion eloquently with the relavent textual back up like normal human being ;)

Sadly I think the "I haz catz" and "catz rulz" brigade are in full force here and are struggling to argue against their little cherubs who cause people grief on a daily basis. There have been times where my parents have been unable to sit in their own back garden due to the stench of cat cr*p someone else's little darlings have kindly deposited in the flower beds.
[quote][p][bold]I-say-you-say[/bold] wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up![/p][/quote]It's very easy for someone to click a button rather than substantiate their opinion eloquently with the relavent textual back up like normal human being ;) Sadly I think the "I haz catz" and "catz rulz" brigade are in full force here and are struggling to argue against their little cherubs who cause people grief on a daily basis. There have been times where my parents have been unable to sit in their own back garden due to the stench of cat cr*p someone else's little darlings have kindly deposited in the flower beds. Russ13
  • Score: -12

4:28pm Mon 7 Jul 14

pembury53 says...

I-say-you-say wrote:
Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative.

How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere?

How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?!

I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up!
"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks....
[quote][p][bold]I-say-you-say[/bold] wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up![/p][/quote]"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks.... pembury53
  • Score: 9

9:06pm Mon 7 Jul 14

hornsxandxhalos says...

To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it.
Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know.
To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it. Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know. hornsxandxhalos
  • Score: 12

9:22pm Mon 7 Jul 14

Walt Jabsco says...

scrounger‎ wrote:
We need manufacturers to put a repellent in the anti freeze.
look on the labels at Halfords, its already done by some
[quote][p][bold]scrounger‎[/bold] wrote: We need manufacturers to put a repellent in the anti freeze.[/p][/quote]look on the labels at Halfords, its already done by some Walt Jabsco
  • Score: 4

4:02am Tue 8 Jul 14

emcee says...

hornsxandxhalos wrote:
To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it.
Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know.
Your comment proves you know very little about cats.
[quote][p][bold]hornsxandxhalos[/bold] wrote: To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it. Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know.[/p][/quote]Your comment proves you know very little about cats. emcee
  • Score: 4

8:21am Tue 8 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

hornsxandxhalos wrote:
To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it.
Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know.
What absolute nonsense!!!!

I have watch 2 different cats drop their cr*p in my garden and saunter off without even looking back, let along bury their filthy mess!

I'd rather every car owner look a "****" walking their animal on a lead than have to pick up their cr*p.

Perhaps cat owners should be made to make sure their gardens are fully enclosed to their cat can't tresspass into neighbouring gardens?
[quote][p][bold]hornsxandxhalos[/bold] wrote: To all the people saying that cats should be kept indoors and how they crap all over your garden, well firstly, cats are not dogs, they don't like to or shouldn't be cooped up indoors, you cannot take a cat out for a walk on a leash, they'd look **** ridiculous and hate it. Secondly, they bury their ****, so it's not left all over your gardens, there are other animals like foxes that are about as well y'know.[/p][/quote]What absolute nonsense!!!! I have watch 2 different cats drop their cr*p in my garden and saunter off without even looking back, let along bury their filthy mess! I'd rather every car owner look a "****" walking their animal on a lead than have to pick up their cr*p. Perhaps cat owners should be made to make sure their gardens are fully enclosed to their cat can't tresspass into neighbouring gardens? Russ13
  • Score: -4

8:34am Tue 8 Jul 14

VeteranOfMany says...

Trouble with stories like this, which won't solve anything, is for some nutters out there, they will give it a try, thanks for this news item.
Trouble with stories like this, which won't solve anything, is for some nutters out there, they will give it a try, thanks for this news item. VeteranOfMany
  • Score: 1

9:40am Tue 8 Jul 14

I-say-you-say says...

pembury53 wrote:
I-say-you-say wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up!
"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks....
Which a majority of dog owners clean up or face a fine if they don't.

Do cat owners go around picking up the deposits their little trespassing darlings have left in whoever's garden etc they want? No! Do they get a fine if they don't? No!

Now don't get me wrong, I am not by any means condoning anyone purposefully posioning any pet. However, I will not be considered to be held even remotely responsible for the harm of any animal that is allowed by its owner to be left roaming around unsupervised - especially in or on my property.

Cats will eat/drink what they want, whether it's good for them or not, they will go where they want, whether it's good for them or not. They will get poisioned, they will get run over. If you don't like it - don't have a cat or don't let it out! Simple!
[quote][p][bold]pembury53[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]I-say-you-say[/bold] wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up![/p][/quote]"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks....[/p][/quote]Which a majority of dog owners clean up or face a fine if they don't. Do cat owners go around picking up the deposits their little trespassing darlings have left in whoever's garden etc they want? No! Do they get a fine if they don't? No! Now don't get me wrong, I am not by any means condoning anyone purposefully posioning any pet. However, I will not be considered to be held even remotely responsible for the harm of any animal that is allowed by its owner to be left roaming around unsupervised - especially in or on my property. Cats will eat/drink what they want, whether it's good for them or not, they will go where they want, whether it's good for them or not. They will get poisioned, they will get run over. If you don't like it - don't have a cat or don't let it out! Simple! I-say-you-say
  • Score: 2

10:13am Tue 8 Jul 14

pembury53 says...

I-say-you-say wrote:
pembury53 wrote:
I-say-you-say wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up!
"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks....
Which a majority of dog owners clean up or face a fine if they don't.

Do cat owners go around picking up the deposits their little trespassing darlings have left in whoever's garden etc they want? No! Do they get a fine if they don't? No!

Now don't get me wrong, I am not by any means condoning anyone purposefully posioning any pet. However, I will not be considered to be held even remotely responsible for the harm of any animal that is allowed by its owner to be left roaming around unsupervised - especially in or on my property.

Cats will eat/drink what they want, whether it's good for them or not, they will go where they want, whether it's good for them or not. They will get poisioned, they will get run over. If you don't like it - don't have a cat or don't let it out! Simple!
I think you will find the number of fines issued (in southend ever) for dog cr****ng is approximately zero, the councils argument being that it's too difficult to catch people and have evidence to prosecute. I find that strange, since they can identify a traffic violation in seconds, without you even being aware of it, there have also been succesful prosecutions for dropping litter. I think the real reason is they they don't fancy confronting a track suited idiot with a killing machine on a lead (if lucky)..... the majority of owners may well clear up, but take a walk around westcliff streets and you'll find the minority thats left is a significant one.....
[quote][p][bold]I-say-you-say[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pembury53[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]I-say-you-say[/bold] wrote: Interesting....all these negative votes on what appears to be very valid points and yet nobody actually backing them up with decent evidence to the alternative. How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up? How would you feel if they then let them jump up on your car leaving scratch marks and dirty prints everywhere? How about people take responsibility for what is their own and stop trying to pin the blame on anyone and everyone else for your own problems. Don't want your cat getting hurt, don't let it out. You wouldn't let a dog or a human get away with it so why should they?! I now await further negative votes without the valid points to back them up![/p][/quote]"How would you feel if a dog owner let their dog defecate in your garden constantly and you had to clear it up?" are you serious ? they don't need to gain entry to your garden to ruin your day,, they just let their filthy muts deposit stinking piles of it all over the public footpaths and parks....[/p][/quote]Which a majority of dog owners clean up or face a fine if they don't. Do cat owners go around picking up the deposits their little trespassing darlings have left in whoever's garden etc they want? No! Do they get a fine if they don't? No! Now don't get me wrong, I am not by any means condoning anyone purposefully posioning any pet. However, I will not be considered to be held even remotely responsible for the harm of any animal that is allowed by its owner to be left roaming around unsupervised - especially in or on my property. Cats will eat/drink what they want, whether it's good for them or not, they will go where they want, whether it's good for them or not. They will get poisioned, they will get run over. If you don't like it - don't have a cat or don't let it out! Simple![/p][/quote]I think you will find the number of fines issued (in southend ever) for dog cr****ng is approximately zero, the councils argument being that it's too difficult to catch people and have evidence to prosecute. I find that strange, since they can identify a traffic violation in seconds, without you even being aware of it, there have also been succesful prosecutions for dropping litter. I think the real reason is they they don't fancy confronting a track suited idiot with a killing machine on a lead (if lucky)..... the majority of owners may well clear up, but take a walk around westcliff streets and you'll find the minority thats left is a significant one..... pembury53
  • Score: 4

11:28am Tue 8 Jul 14

FelinePsych101 says...

Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more. FelinePsych101
  • Score: 7

12:09pm Tue 8 Jul 14

pussycats says...

Thank you FelinePsych101 for posting your eloquent, welcomed and informative comment. My understandings and sentiments exactly, but could not have written it, as well as you.
Thank you FelinePsych101 for posting your eloquent, welcomed and informative comment. My understandings and sentiments exactly, but could not have written it, as well as you. pussycats
  • Score: -1

12:32pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Thanks for sharing your feline knowledge with us, it was most enlightening.

Would you perhaps be able to give us any tips to help us non-cat-lovers in how to prevent these little darlings from making a mess of our gardens?

I couldn't give two hoots about "an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs", especially if that area happens to be on MY property. Regardless of whether you believe humans should or shouldn't own the planet, as far as I'm concerned I own a few hundred square feet of it that I would like to keep s**t free!
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.[/p][/quote]Thanks for sharing your feline knowledge with us, it was most enlightening. Would you perhaps be able to give us any tips to help us non-cat-lovers in how to prevent these little darlings from making a mess of our gardens? I couldn't give two hoots about "an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs", especially if that area happens to be on MY property. Regardless of whether you believe humans should or shouldn't own the planet, as far as I'm concerned I own a few hundred square feet of it that I would like to keep s**t free! Russ13
  • Score: 2

12:39pm Tue 8 Jul 14

FelinePsych101 says...

Russ13 wrote:
FelinePsych101 wrote:
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Thanks for sharing your feline knowledge with us, it was most enlightening.

Would you perhaps be able to give us any tips to help us non-cat-lovers in how to prevent these little darlings from making a mess of our gardens?

I couldn't give two hoots about "an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs", especially if that area happens to be on MY property. Regardless of whether you believe humans should or shouldn't own the planet, as far as I'm concerned I own a few hundred square feet of it that I would like to keep s**t free!
There's a product I'm told is very effective called Silent Roar. It is, in effect, lion dung. The principle is that the cat recognises the smell of a larger predator and is less likely to claim an area as their own.

If you tell me what you've tried as a preventative measure I'll be more than happy to suggest other possibilities that might help.

As I said, though....responsibl
e owners neuter their cats, and that lessens the chances of a cat middening. It may be worth trying to find out where the cat lives and speaking to the owner to see if they've done that.
[quote][p][bold]Russ13[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.[/p][/quote]Thanks for sharing your feline knowledge with us, it was most enlightening. Would you perhaps be able to give us any tips to help us non-cat-lovers in how to prevent these little darlings from making a mess of our gardens? I couldn't give two hoots about "an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs", especially if that area happens to be on MY property. Regardless of whether you believe humans should or shouldn't own the planet, as far as I'm concerned I own a few hundred square feet of it that I would like to keep s**t free![/p][/quote]There's a product I'm told is very effective called Silent Roar. It is, in effect, lion dung. The principle is that the cat recognises the smell of a larger predator and is less likely to claim an area as their own. If you tell me what you've tried as a preventative measure I'll be more than happy to suggest other possibilities that might help. As I said, though....responsibl e owners neuter their cats, and that lessens the chances of a cat middening. It may be worth trying to find out where the cat lives and speaking to the owner to see if they've done that. FelinePsych101
  • Score: 0

12:45pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Tom from Southend says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Agreed, we do share the planet.

I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch.

Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs.
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.[/p][/quote]Agreed, we do share the planet. I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch. Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs. Tom from Southend
  • Score: -3

1:16pm Tue 8 Jul 14

FelinePsych101 says...

Tom from Southend wrote:
FelinePsych101 wrote:
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Agreed, we do share the planet.

I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch.

Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs.
Tom, please see the previous post about deterrents. As I said, you state what's been tried and I'm happy to suggest other alternatives if they've not worked.

As an aside, my cats are actively encouraged to toilet in their own garden and they do. I've seen them using their "allocated toilet area" more than once. I've also assisted neighbours in previous years if my cats decided to claim other peoples gardens and found safe, humane deterrents that worked.
[quote][p][bold]Tom from Southend[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.[/p][/quote]Agreed, we do share the planet. I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch. Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs.[/p][/quote]Tom, please see the previous post about deterrents. As I said, you state what's been tried and I'm happy to suggest other alternatives if they've not worked. As an aside, my cats are actively encouraged to toilet in their own garden and they do. I've seen them using their "allocated toilet area" more than once. I've also assisted neighbours in previous years if my cats decided to claim other peoples gardens and found safe, humane deterrents that worked. FelinePsych101
  • Score: 0

1:29pm Tue 8 Jul 14

I-say-you-say says...

I don't think you're getting the point - yes there is deterrants to stop cats going into your garden but firstly, why should I pay for something to stop someone elses animal defecating my garden? Secondly, why should I also have to do this on/in/around my garage to stop them going in the garage and potentially eating or drinking something harmful to them and thirdly, what could I put on my vehicle that I have paid a lot of money for and do not appreciate cat paw prints/scratches on to deter them - because I am sure as hell not covering it in lion urine!
I don't think you're getting the point - yes there is deterrants to stop cats going into your garden but firstly, why should I pay for something to stop someone elses animal defecating my garden? Secondly, why should I also have to do this on/in/around my garage to stop them going in the garage and potentially eating or drinking something harmful to them and thirdly, what could I put on my vehicle that I have paid a lot of money for and do not appreciate cat paw prints/scratches on to deter them - because I am sure as hell not covering it in lion urine! I-say-you-say
  • Score: 0

2:11pm Tue 8 Jul 14

FelinePsych101 says...

Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car.

If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money.

If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.
Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car. If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money. If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much. FelinePsych101
  • Score: 5

3:02pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Russ13 says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car.

If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money.

If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.
Shared planet or not, I work hard to have a house with a garden and a car. By your logic it would be perfectly acceptable for anyone or anything to cause damage to your personal possessions as we all share the planet and can do what we want when we want?

More to the point, why should non-cat owners have to go to extra trouble and expense to prevent such damage occuring due to the behaviour of someone elses pet?

I've tried plenty of deterrents including scents but none are that great, especially if it rains where they're washed away and need replenishing, again at additional cost
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car. If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money. If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.[/p][/quote]Shared planet or not, I work hard to have a house with a garden and a car. By your logic it would be perfectly acceptable for anyone or anything to cause damage to your personal possessions as we all share the planet and can do what we want when we want? More to the point, why should non-cat owners have to go to extra trouble and expense to prevent such damage occuring due to the behaviour of someone elses pet? I've tried plenty of deterrents including scents but none are that great, especially if it rains where they're washed away and need replenishing, again at additional cost Russ13
  • Score: 0

3:19pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Tom from Southend says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Tom from Southend wrote:
FelinePsych101 wrote:
Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about.

I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.”

The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely.

As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat.

The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place.

Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t.

As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes.

Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.
Agreed, we do share the planet.

I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch.

Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs.
Tom, please see the previous post about deterrents. As I said, you state what's been tried and I'm happy to suggest other alternatives if they've not worked.

As an aside, my cats are actively encouraged to toilet in their own garden and they do. I've seen them using their "allocated toilet area" more than once. I've also assisted neighbours in previous years if my cats decided to claim other peoples gardens and found safe, humane deterrents that worked.
I have tried, pepper spray, water bottles, sonic sounder (it cost me) etc etc but why should I.

If my kids did cause havoc on your property would you be expected to install deterrents? No of course not. I make sure the actions in my life do not detrimentally affect others. Cat owners quite clearly don't think about this. They just let there cats crap everywhere.
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tom from Southend[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Just so everyone gets a balanced perspective and is aware that the only pro-cat posters are not illiterate cat lovers with no awareness of their feline family members behaviour when they’re out and about. I’m a trained feline behaviourist. I recognise the reason that cats act the way they do is infinitely more than “they need the toilet” or “they hunt for fun.” The cats that don’t bury their mess are likely to live in a built up area with many other cats; a lot of which are likely to be entire. Entire cats territory mark by using a technique called middenining, which is toileting and leaving their mess uncovered. You want to get angry at someone, maybe look at the irresponsible owners not making the possibility of this less likely. As for hunting for fun; the hunt is pure instinct for a cat. There’s no malice intended at all. Even the RSPB states that the number of bird prey captured by cats is not the main reason for the decline of native garden birds. If people look into it, they’ll find that would be human disruption to habitat. The other species that cats are most likely to hunt are rodents; which ironically is the reason cats were introduced into this country in the first place. Cats do not recognise human made boundaries. Why would they? Do you recognise an area locally to you a cat has claimed as specifically theirs? Of course you don’t. As for the comparative between cats and dogs; this is unrealistic. They’re very different animals with very different thought processes. Contrary to human opinion, we don’t own the planet. We share it with a large number of other animals. A little consideration, courtesy and understanding about their behaviour only takes a small amount of time. Ensuring their safety costs thought, nothing more.[/p][/quote]Agreed, we do share the planet. I don't dump in someone's garden so why should someone's cat do it in mine. Its a problem for me and my young family. We are regularly scraping up cat $h!te from the garden. And its in our veggie patch. Cat owners feel they have the right to let their vermin do what they want once outside their homes, just as long as its not in theirs.[/p][/quote]Tom, please see the previous post about deterrents. As I said, you state what's been tried and I'm happy to suggest other alternatives if they've not worked. As an aside, my cats are actively encouraged to toilet in their own garden and they do. I've seen them using their "allocated toilet area" more than once. I've also assisted neighbours in previous years if my cats decided to claim other peoples gardens and found safe, humane deterrents that worked.[/p][/quote]I have tried, pepper spray, water bottles, sonic sounder (it cost me) etc etc but why should I. If my kids did cause havoc on your property would you be expected to install deterrents? No of course not. I make sure the actions in my life do not detrimentally affect others. Cat owners quite clearly don't think about this. They just let there cats crap everywhere. Tom from Southend
  • Score: -1

4:12pm Tue 8 Jul 14

FelinePsych101 says...

Again, people are using non-comparative comparatives. (No, I do not think "anyone" should be allowed to damage someones property. A human exhibiting a human thought process and rationalisation will recognise someone elses boundaries and possessions. Nor would I find it acceptable if someone let their child "free roam" on my garden. Again, human logic and thinking applies. That said, I would go outside and ask them where their parents were as it would give me cause for concern.)

Until people stop refusing to only look at situations from a human perspective and consider the fact that animals are different to us, but not necessarily less, then they'll always be those that find their behaviour annoying without really considering what can be done to make it better.
Again, people are using non-comparative comparatives. (No, I do not think "anyone" should be allowed to damage someones property. A human exhibiting a human thought process and rationalisation will recognise someone elses boundaries and possessions. Nor would I find it acceptable if someone let their child "free roam" on my garden. Again, human logic and thinking applies. That said, I would go outside and ask them where their parents were as it would give me cause for concern.) Until people stop refusing to only look at situations from a human perspective and consider the fact that animals are different to us, but not necessarily less, then they'll always be those that find their behaviour annoying without really considering what can be done to make it better. FelinePsych101
  • Score: 0

4:26pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Tom from Southend says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Again, people are using non-comparative comparatives. (No, I do not think "anyone" should be allowed to damage someones property. A human exhibiting a human thought process and rationalisation will recognise someone elses boundaries and possessions. Nor would I find it acceptable if someone let their child "free roam" on my garden. Again, human logic and thinking applies. That said, I would go outside and ask them where their parents were as it would give me cause for concern.)

Until people stop refusing to only look at situations from a human perspective and consider the fact that animals are different to us, but not necessarily less, then they'll always be those that find their behaviour annoying without really considering what can be done to make it better.
This is quite clearly a ridiculous position to take. Of course cats don't posses human traits. Cat owners (humans) own cats for their own (human) pleasure but appear to disregard other people (being human) when owning these pests. It is not the cats fault its cr@ps on my garden where my kids play or in the veggie patch where we try to grow our own food, its the cat owners fault for completely disregarding others.

Its this disregarding behaviour that drives people to take these extreme measures ie antifreeze for cats.

How is that for a comparative-comparat
ive.
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Again, people are using non-comparative comparatives. (No, I do not think "anyone" should be allowed to damage someones property. A human exhibiting a human thought process and rationalisation will recognise someone elses boundaries and possessions. Nor would I find it acceptable if someone let their child "free roam" on my garden. Again, human logic and thinking applies. That said, I would go outside and ask them where their parents were as it would give me cause for concern.) Until people stop refusing to only look at situations from a human perspective and consider the fact that animals are different to us, but not necessarily less, then they'll always be those that find their behaviour annoying without really considering what can be done to make it better.[/p][/quote]This is quite clearly a ridiculous position to take. Of course cats don't posses human traits. Cat owners (humans) own cats for their own (human) pleasure but appear to disregard other people (being human) when owning these pests. It is not the cats fault its cr@ps on my garden where my kids play or in the veggie patch where we try to grow our own food, its the cat owners fault for completely disregarding others. Its this disregarding behaviour that drives people to take these extreme measures ie antifreeze for cats. How is that for a comparative-comparat ive. Tom from Southend
  • Score: -1

4:42pm Tue 8 Jul 14

Tom from Southend says...

Russ13 wrote:
FelinePsych101 wrote:
Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car.

If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money.

If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.
Shared planet or not, I work hard to have a house with a garden and a car. By your logic it would be perfectly acceptable for anyone or anything to cause damage to your personal possessions as we all share the planet and can do what we want when we want?

More to the point, why should non-cat owners have to go to extra trouble and expense to prevent such damage occuring due to the behaviour of someone elses pet?

I've tried plenty of deterrents including scents but none are that great, especially if it rains where they're washed away and need replenishing, again at additional cost
Russ13...exactly
[quote][p][bold]Russ13[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car. If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money. If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.[/p][/quote]Shared planet or not, I work hard to have a house with a garden and a car. By your logic it would be perfectly acceptable for anyone or anything to cause damage to your personal possessions as we all share the planet and can do what we want when we want? More to the point, why should non-cat owners have to go to extra trouble and expense to prevent such damage occuring due to the behaviour of someone elses pet? I've tried plenty of deterrents including scents but none are that great, especially if it rains where they're washed away and need replenishing, again at additional cost[/p][/quote]Russ13...exactly Tom from Southend
  • Score: -6

10:22am Wed 9 Jul 14

I-say-you-say says...

FelinePsych101 wrote:
Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car. If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money. If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.
I don't think so - and I think you have been a little hypocritical here in regards to your uncomparative comparatives.

A bird doing it's business on my car is unavoidable as it is a "wild and free animal" and there is no owner to control where it goes or what it does. Plus a bit of FREE warm water soon sorts that out.

A cat on the other hand is a pet that has an owner who purposefully allows it to wander where it wants, doing what it wants and then when it is harmed etc blames everyone else for not taking it into consideration!

I appreciate that I have to pay out for some things, I am not a complete moron! But I refuse to pay to stop something that is someone elses responsibility and then get the blame when it goes wrong!

As for the garage, it is not big enough for a vehicle, just storage and an area where I can work on my car when required.

So I will repeat again - if you don't want your pet to get hurt, whether it be cat, dog, lizard or elephant - do NOT let it roam free and then blame everyone else if it gets injured/poisoned etc!
[quote][p][bold]FelinePsych101[/bold] wrote: Sadly, I think you're also missing a valid point. This is a shared planet, there are other animals on it. I'm guessing you're also unhappy that birds toilet and get some of their mess on your car. If you value your home but recognise you're co-existing in an environment you sometimes have to do things that may cost you a little money. If you have a garage, why is your car not in there so cats can't walk on it? I'm just wondering seeing as it seems to upset you so much.[/p][/quote]I don't think so - and I think you have been a little hypocritical here in regards to your uncomparative comparatives. A bird doing it's business on my car is unavoidable as it is a "wild and free animal" and there is no owner to control where it goes or what it does. Plus a bit of FREE warm water soon sorts that out. A cat on the other hand is a pet that has an owner who purposefully allows it to wander where it wants, doing what it wants and then when it is harmed etc blames everyone else for not taking it into consideration! I appreciate that I have to pay out for some things, I am not a complete moron! But I refuse to pay to stop something that is someone elses responsibility and then get the blame when it goes wrong! As for the garage, it is not big enough for a vehicle, just storage and an area where I can work on my car when required. So I will repeat again - if you don't want your pet to get hurt, whether it be cat, dog, lizard or elephant - do NOT let it roam free and then blame everyone else if it gets injured/poisoned etc! I-say-you-say
  • Score: -6

10:28am Wed 9 Jul 14

Nelly99 says...

I love cats but one thing I,ve never understood. If cat hair sticks to everything why doesn't it stick to cats!
I love cats but one thing I,ve never understood. If cat hair sticks to everything why doesn't it stick to cats! Nelly99
  • Score: 1
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